{"id":1134188,"date":"2026-02-04T02:16:53","date_gmt":"2026-02-04T02:16:53","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.polygon.com\/?p=527216"},"modified":"2026-02-04T02:16:53","modified_gmt":"2026-02-04T02:16:53","slug":"an-abandoned-legacy-of-kain-sequel-put-sam-barlow-on-the-path-to-her-story","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/arcader.org\/news\/an-abandoned-legacy-of-kain-sequel-put-sam-barlow-on-the-path-to-her-story\/","title":{"rendered":"An abandoned Legacy of Kain sequel put Sam Barlow on the path to Her Story"},"content":{"rendered":"<figure> <img decoding=\"async\" alt=\"\" data-caption=\"\" data-portal-copyright=\"Image: Square Enix\" data-has-syndication-rights=\"1\" src=\"https:\/\/arcader.org\/wp-content\/uploads\/2025\/02\/an-abandoned-legacy-of-kain-sequel-put-sam-barlow-on-the-path-to-her-story.jpg\" \/><figcaption><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><em>In Sam Barlow\u2019s <\/em>Her Story<em>, the narrative is uncovered entirely at the player\u2019s direction. In this interview excerpt, Barlow talks about how previous experiences in mainstream games made him long for a game where there\u2019s no hand-holding at all<\/em>, <em>and the player is left to their own devices<\/em>.<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><em>This interview was done in September as part of the release of <a href=\"https:\/\/youtu.be\/tFYBsnVfT-w\">our documentary <\/a><\/em><a href=\"https:\/\/youtu.be\/tFYBsnVfT-w\">The Great Game: The Making of Spycraft<\/a><em>, about one of the most ambitious FMV games of the \u201990s. You can watch the full interview above.<\/em><\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><strong>Sam Barlow: <\/strong>A frustration I had coming out of making 3D games was the obsession with continuous time and space, and the obsession with embodying a character in a world. It made storytelling harder in some ways. It stopped you from using certain tricks. And there are examples, like <em>Thirty Flights of Loving<\/em>, and stuff where [&#8230;] you can just click and you can jump somewhere else, and people will figure it out!<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\">Growing up, as I was maturing into an adult, I was a PC gamer, and my big thing was immersive sims. They were my favorite. If you had caught me at the right age, my favorite games would&#8217;ve been <em>Thief<\/em>, <em>System Shock<\/em>, <em>Deus Ex<\/em>, <em>Ultima Underworld<\/em>. If you&#8217;d asked me to have an opinion, I&#8217;d have been like, \u201cThe future of games, man, is going to be like the Holodeck.\u201d More and more simulation, more and more immersion. I am just the character in a world, stacking boxes and doing stuff.\u00a0<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\">Then I kind of grew up a bit more. And then when I started working in games, I became much more of a Nintendo-head. What Nintendo was doing was way more sophisticated and interesting, and the extent to which they were thinking about the player&#8217;s desires and the intent of the player was really cool.&nbsp;<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\">When I went and made<em> Silent Hill: Shattered Memories<\/em>, that was kind of my love letter to immersive sims, and the idea of creating a continuous space where your physical presence in the space is extremely \u201cimmersive.\u201d And we did a lot of stuff in that game that was kind of trying to remove the artificiality. No menus, no loading, everything was seamless, there were lots of beats where we were trying to make you feel physically connected to the world. As I was doing that, I was really aware as a storyteller that a lot of these assumptions around the player, the player character, are really limiting. And there&#8217;s a deliberate setup in that game which is going, <em>Hey, everything&#8217;s telling you that you are the player character, that you should identify with this character<\/em>, but, spoilers, this character is not a real thing. And so coming off of that, I had cured myself and now I wanted to try doing even more interesting things, and immediately became director of the [eventually cancelled sixth] Legacy of Kain game with a lot of publisher input where they were like, <em>No, dude, you gotta have visceral combat!<\/em><\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><strong>Justin McElroy: <\/strong>Bigger swords!<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><strong>Barlow: <\/strong>And collectibles!\u00a0<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\">So when I made <em>Her Story<\/em>, I very consciously was going: <em>If I&#8217;m going to make an indie game, I&#8217;m going to take some of these ideas I&#8217;ve been having of, like, why is it the default that we are a 3D character in a 3D world, with continuous time and space?<\/em> I&#8217;m the avatar. We&#8217;d gone through that whole discourse of <a href=\"https:\/\/www.polygon.com\/2020\/6\/26\/21304642\/the-last-of-us-2-violence\">narrative dissonance<\/a>, which to me also was maybe the wrong discussion to be having, this assumption that there should be no dissonance, that I should be doing things, and they should work and everything should behave like the real world. And so <em>Her Story<\/em> was me\u2026 I remember I wrote a little manifesto, to be fully pretentious. That was: \u201cI&#8217;m going to make a game that has no state model.\u201d Like 99% of <em>Her Story<\/em>, you&#8217;re not meaningfully changing the state of the game. So there is no choice and consequence, there is no \u201csomeone will remember this,\u201d there&#8217;s no accumulated score or progress, there are no bottlenecks.<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><strong>McElroy: <\/strong>There&#8217;s only three rocket launchers, total.<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><strong>Barlow: <\/strong>Yeah, two key puzzles. [<em>both laugh<\/em>]<em> <\/em>One of the other things was: no 3D movement. No player inhabitation of a character. And then the other one was subtext. I&#8217;d had lots of arguments with a producer on the game I was working on, where I would submit script drafts and they would read it and they&#8217;d be like, \u201cHey, why isn&#8217;t the character saying what they&#8217;re thinking?\u201d\u00a0<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\">And I was like, \u201cNo, dude, that&#8217;s bad writing, right? No one writes like this. All the cool stuff should be in subtext.\u201d And the argument from them at the time was: \u201cTheoretically, but we don&#8217;t have the tech to communicate the nuance that guarantees this will come across in a way that a movie can.\u201d And my response to that was like, \u201cWell, couldn&#8217;t we at least try?\u201d But there was this interesting sort of argument to usability of, if the story equals your quest \u2014 if the story and your mission objective are one and the same \u2014 and if the player wants to have a good time, they should understand everything. And so everything should be extremely overstated and clear. And so with <em>Her Story<\/em> I was like, <em>I explicitly want to make a game where subtext is important<\/em>.<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><strong>McElroy: <\/strong>Thinking about this state that you were in earlier in your career, where you&#8217;re in increasing and decreasing levels of control, do you feel like working in FMV games, where you are directing the footage that&#8217;s being shot and then designing how the game will implement that footage, do you feel like you have more control over the end product? Do you think that&#8217;s something that&#8217;s important to you?<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><strong>Barlow: <\/strong>Probably on balance, no. I think one of the things that&#8217;s interesting, specifically when I was doing <em>Her Story<\/em>, I had the moment where I was designing it where I was like, <em>There should be no traditional flow and scripting and bottlenecking<\/em>. You would play something like Phoenix Wright; it&#8217;s very carefully hand-held through the mystery. And the big moment for me on<em> Her Story<\/em> was, <em>What if I just let you just search and find anything?<\/em> That&#8217;s going to feel exciting, and freeing, and it could enable you to feel more like you&#8217;re having these leaps of logic. But it&#8217;s kind of scary because everything else I had ever done as a game designer, you fake the freedom, and there is a level of control. But I had this little prototype where I was \u201cplaying\u201d some transcripts I&#8217;d got of a real-life police interrogation, and I was like, <em>It&#8217;s so cool<\/em>. This game mechanic of word searching [&#8230;] I wanted to try and recreate that feeling for my players. So I think with the FMV games, the ones I&#8217;ve done, I&#8217;ve increasingly tried to compensate for the weirdness versus a traditional game \u2014 for the apparent lack of reactivity \u2014 with an increasing player freedom, and also at the same time a generosity and a lack of punishment.<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\">I think you can ask a lot of the player. Part of <em>Her Story<\/em> or other games has been going respect the player&#8217;s intelligence. Don&#8217;t overexplain; let them figure stuff out. Allow them to be confused initially. That&#8217;s interesting. But if you sit down and play <em>Her Story, <\/em>or<em> Telling Lies <\/em>or <em>Immortality<\/em>, just by participating, you&#8217;re going to see some stuff, and you&#8217;re going to uncover things, and it&#8217;s all going to be interesting. And if you just keep participating, you will start to put the picture together, and you&#8217;ll start to figure out what&#8217;s going on. And at no point are you told \u2014 [<em>buzzer noise<\/em>] \u2014 \u201cGame over.\u201d Which does happen in <em>Night Trap<\/em>; that was like the cardinal sin of those old FMV games was, <em>Hey, if you get a game over, you&#8217;re seeing the same footage again<\/em>. Suddenly the magic&#8217;s gone. Or even Phoenix Wright, you have the risk-reward mechanic to make it feel like there&#8217;s a challenge to it. But the point in a Phoenix Wright game where you fail and you have to restart\u2026 and you&#8217;re like, <em>Oh my god<\/em>.<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\">I did this little interactive pilot for [production company] Eko of <em>WarGames<\/em>, and when I did <em>Her Story<\/em>, it was very indie, lo-fi. I was costume, makeup, photography, everything. But then when I went and did the <em>WarGames<\/em> thing, it was my first time working with a full film crew. And I remember the wardrobe person coming up to me before we were about to shoot, and they were asking me to choose a hat. And I was like, <em>Why is it so important to them that I pick a hat?<\/em> Because my game director brain was like, <em>You can keep changing hats until you ship. You shoot the mocap, and then you can put different hats on, and you can move the camera, and you can do all this stuff. It is a very obvious thing!<\/em> But suddenly I realized in that moment, <em>Oh shit, yeah, if you&#8217;re shooting live action and we choose the hat, that&#8217;s the hat<\/em>. Outside of Marvel-scale reboots.<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><strong>McElroy: <\/strong>[<em>laughs<\/em>]<strong> <\/strong>Right? \u201cListen, the hat isn&#8217;t working, guy, we got feedback in.\u201d\u00a0<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><strong>Barlow: <\/strong>I love, on a film set, being able to be looking in-camera and then moving props around. I mean, technically I shouldn\u2019t, because that\u2019s a union thing. But I mean, going in and tweaking the <em>mise en sc\u00e8ne<\/em>, and improvising things with the actors, and having that ability to, there and then, be very free. Whereas in games, if I was like, \u201cI want to change the shirt this character&#8217;s wearing,\u201d or if I want them to turn around and pick up this thing, people are going to be like, \u201cSam! Do you know how expensive it is to remodel a shirt or animate picking up a random prop? Like, dude!\u201d So there was this really nice sort of freedom to be hands-on with the footage, but then you realize, <em>Oh, what we commit to becomes frozen in time<\/em>.<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\">Which, I mean, still kind of happens in games. I remember being amazed hearing that on [Fullbright\u2019s] <em>Tacoma<\/em> \u2014 and I can understand why they did this \u2014 I believe with <em>Tacoma<\/em>, one of the very first things they did was record the script, because so much of it would then map out spatially across their spaceship. Because that whole game was like, characters walking around talking, and you can sort of scrub a timeline. So I think they kind of decided that something was going to have to get set in stone to make it all work, and it was the script. But I remember that sounding terrifying to me \u2014 that you&#8217;re making a narrative game and the first thing you lock is the script.\u00a0<\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\">I think there&#8217;s lots of different, interesting things that are or aren&#8217;t fixed. I mean, it&#8217;s funny when people sort of question if an FMV game can even <em>be<\/em> a game because of the lack of player control. And I&#8217;m like, <em>Do you realize what&#8217;s happening when you&#8217;re playing Uncharted? You do realize that 50% of those \u201creal-time\u201d cutscenes are actually pre-rendered to hide streaming and to facilitate things?<\/em><\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\"><em>This is the final excerpt of this conversation between Sam Barlow and Justin McElroy.<\/em> <em>You can read all the previous entries, including <a href=\"https:\/\/www.polygon.com\/q-and-a\/521436\/sam-barlow-justin-mcelroy-art-fixed\">the most recent<\/a>, which contended with Roger Ebert\u2019s famous assertion that art must be fixed, and that video games, with their player choice and multiple endings, cannot be art.<\/em><\/p>\n<p class=\"has-text-align-none\">The Great Game: The Making of Spycraft<em> <\/em><a href=\"https:\/\/nygamecritics.com\/2025\/01\/06\/awards-here-the-nominees-for-the-14th-annual-new-york-game-awards\/\"><em>recently won<\/em><\/a><em> <em>the New York Videogame Critics Circle\u2019s New York Game Award for Best Games Journalism.<\/em><\/em><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/www.polygon.com\/videos\/527216\/sam-barlow-legacy-of-kain-her-story\">Source<\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>In Sam Barlow\u2019s Her Story, the narrative is uncovered entirely at the player\u2019s direction. In this interview excerpt, Barlow talks about how previous experiences in mainstream games made him long for a game where there\u2019s no hand-holding at all, and the player is left to their own devices. This interview was done in September as part of the release of our documentary The Great Game: The Making of Spycraft, about one of the most ambitious FMV games of the \u201990s. You can watch the full interview above. Sam Barlow: A frustration I had coming out of making 3D games was the obsession with continuous time and space, and the obsession with embodying a character in a world. It made storytelling harder in some ways. It&hellip;<\/p>\n<p class=\"excerpt-more\"><a class=\"blog-excerpt button\" href=\"https:\/\/arcader.org\/news\/an-abandoned-legacy-of-kain-sequel-put-sam-barlow-on-the-path-to-her-story\/\">Read More&#8230;<\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":1134189,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[10],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-1134188","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-polygon"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v27.5 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/product\/yoast-seo-wordpress\/ -->\n<title>An abandoned Legacy of Kain sequel put Sam Barlow on the path to Her Story | Arcader News<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"In Sam Barlow\u2019s Her Story, the narrative is uncovered entirely at the player\u2019s direction. 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